Clanranald Muster Roll

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Neil Johnston
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Clanranald Muster Roll

Postby Neil Johnston » Tue Oct 30, 2007 12:39 pm

Hi All
I've recently been reading "Moidart or Among the Clanranalds" which is a history of that area of the Highlands and found it pubished the details of the document
"Part of a roll of men from Clanranald's mainland Estates- with their arms - made up in 1745"

Perhaps others are aware of this partial roll and I'm stating the obvious but I have never seen or heard of it before and it seems to be the real thing.

The details
The roll is a list of 80 Clanranald men detailing the farms, areas, townships and lands they belong to with the names of the men and the weapons they have. I assume from the nature of it the list has been compiled soon after the Prince's landing and before the march on Edinburgh but can't be certain.

16 of the 80 are described as wanting weapons
15 of the 80 have a sword only
15 of the 80 have a gun only
26 of the 80 have sword AND gun
7 of the 80 have gun sword and targe
1 of the 80 has gun and pistol

This roll shows that over 60% of men on the roll had a musket/gun and 60% of men had a sword of some design with over 32% having both. Now whether these weapons are "Highland" or French is not mentioned but in the main they sound like a pretty well armed bunch!!

It also shows that almost 20% had no arms at all and only one man had a pistol (from the place name associated with it probably the poet/ officer Alasdair McMhaighstir Alasdair) and no mention of Lochaber axes.

10% had the "full panoply of highland weaponry" interestingly these names and the homes mentioned do seem to be associated with the duaine uasail of the clan and are probably all officers.

I can probably send anyone a scan of the book pages that are relevant for further personal study if they like............just PM me.

I'd be interested in any comments or thoughts?
Cheers
Neil
Last edited by Neil Johnston on Tue Oct 30, 2007 1:27 pm, edited 2 times in total.


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Postby m300572 » Tue Oct 30, 2007 1:19 pm

Would be interesting to compare that list with the prisoner lists - I'll try and remember to photcopy the relevant pages from Prisoners of the 45 for you.


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Andy R
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Postby Andy R » Tue Oct 30, 2007 4:55 pm

Chuck didn't bring any weapons with him did he?

I'd wager all the weapons were personal ones, and more than likely of some civilian design or other.


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Postby Neil Johnston » Tue Oct 30, 2007 5:45 pm

Don't think so Andy
I think Charlie boy's arms shipment was on the other intercepted boat with the French troops.
Interesting old reference though.... shows what a well armed population the Highlands was in 1745 especially in regard to muskets and possibly long before any arms shipments arrived.
I wonder how the Clan MacHalford would explain that one? :wink:
Cheers
Neil
By the way what is the deal with these French swords you were talking about on the other forum? Quite fancy one for my Lowland Jacobite kit :)


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Henrik Bjoern Boegh
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Postby Henrik Bjoern Boegh » Tue Oct 30, 2007 6:06 pm

Neil,
That's a great source you've got there! Please e-mail it to me if you have the chance. Is the book available on the net?

I think the swords issued by Charlie might be Epee du Soldat (I know Andy's got one) and they are available at http://www.gggodwin.com
Image
They cost 215 USD and considering the current rate it would probably be the right time to buy one.
I saw somewhere in both the biography by Frank McLynn and in Duffy's The '45 references to cheap French broadswords. If these were epees or cavalery broadswords I have no idea.

Cheers,
Henrik


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Postby Tod » Tue Oct 30, 2007 6:17 pm

I've got one as well and they are rubbish. Mind you I bet the originals were too.



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Postby Neil Johnston » Tue Oct 30, 2007 9:36 pm

Hi Henrik
I will sort out a scan and email of the relevant pages for you sometime this week. I had never heard of this original source before although I was aware of the book...........obviously as I had it!!!
It is available second hand online but probably still in a few bookshops in Scotland, it is a really nice local history written in 1860s but refers to earlier documents.

As for the sword I was thinking more of this one.

http://www.raystownforge.com/cat/images ... Soldat.jpg

at $65.

If they're rubbish anyway then best to get cheap rubbish!!!
Cheers
Neil
Attachments
FrenchEpeeduSoldat.jpg


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Andy R
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Postby Andy R » Tue Oct 30, 2007 10:22 pm

McFarthingbowl sells them for £50 at the markets

http://www.re-enactmentshop.com/p_18th_century.htm

Also try Loyalist arms for good conversion rates.


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Andy R
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Postby Andy R » Tue Oct 30, 2007 10:24 pm

Tod wrote:I've got one as well and they are rubbish. Mind you I bet the originals were too.


Oh aye, even going back to the civil war, issued sidearms were notoriously poor, and more often than not they were broken while doing camp duties.


Young men have often been ruined through owning horses, or through backing them, but never through riding them: unless of course they break their necks, which, taken at a gallop, is a very good death to die



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Postby Wim-Jaap » Wed Oct 31, 2007 7:20 am

@Neil: I'm interested in that scan too, could you send it too mee too please?

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Postby Merlon » Wed Oct 31, 2007 7:38 am

The book was reprinted in 1997 and is available on Amazon
MacDonald, C. Moidart Among the Clanranalds. 1997 Birlinn
Publisher: Birlinn Publishers; 2Rev Ed edition (January 1999)
ISBN-10: 1874744653.
It is not obvious on Google books or JSTOR



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Henrik Bjoern Boegh
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Postby Henrik Bjoern Boegh » Wed Oct 31, 2007 2:53 pm

Andy R wrote:
Tod wrote:I've got one as well and they are rubbish. Mind you I bet the originals were too.


Oh aye, even going back to the civil war, issued sidearms were notoriously poor, and more often than not they were broken while doing camp duties.


Another reason to engage the enemy with the musket butt or bayonet... A plus side to using the bayonet is that you get to fix the bayonet and hear that wonderful "CHING!" sound :D

Merlon, I just ordered a copy of the book from Amazon. Thanks!

Cheers,
Henrik


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Redders
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Postby Redders » Wed Oct 31, 2007 5:02 pm

'CHING'

A Definition: More rewarding than 'Click'.



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Postby peter large » Wed Oct 31, 2007 5:21 pm

Redders wrote:'CHING'

A
Definition: More rewarding than 'Click'.
And Redders being a Red Coat you would know all about Click :D :D :D :D


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Andy R
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Postby Andy R » Wed Oct 31, 2007 8:44 pm

I don't know, I always thought the going click (or bang) was just the preliminary bit that get's in the way before falling on with 17.5" of triangular section "Mr. Stabby".


Young men have often been ruined through owning horses, or through backing them, but never through riding them: unless of course they break their necks, which, taken at a gallop, is a very good death to die



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Postby Scottish Lady » Thu Nov 01, 2007 9:08 pm

Hi Neil, Have had that book on my shelf for some time and have usually overlooked it as a source, so thanks for making me give it some proper consideration. Could the swords and muskets have been brought over by the Spanish in the 19 rebellion. The ' Meenister' (Ian)


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Andy R
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Postby Andy R » Thu Nov 01, 2007 9:54 pm

The muskets that came over in 1719 came with the bodies to fire them as well from what I can tell.

I think the Spanish were using miquilet locks at the time, which as well as being unique to Spain were also bloody awful and replaced in later models


Young men have often been ruined through owning horses, or through backing them, but never through riding them: unless of course they break their necks, which, taken at a gallop, is a very good death to die



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Neil Johnston
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Postby Neil Johnston » Fri Nov 02, 2007 10:07 am

Hi Ian(Meenister)
Not sure about the details, it is just gun that is mentioned other than the single pistol.
It is possible some were Spanish but I can't remember if Clanranald were even involved in 1719. I also seem to remember reading that those particular weapons were called Spainneach(?sp) in Gaelic so maybe the compiler of the roll would have noted them specifically........I don't know :?

I know what you mean about the book. I bought it on holiday up there a while back but hadn't bothered that much about it. I had kind of run out of reading material pre Christmas and thought I would read through it.... actually in relation to 17thC stuff (plus it has a nice picture of Castle Tioram on the front) and noticed the info.

By the way hope you both enjoy Fraser's Banquet. Unfortunately Shonna and I can't make it :cry:
I'm sure it will be a cracking night for all though.
Cheers
Neil


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