hooks and eyes

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kate/bob
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hooks and eyes

Postby kate/bob » Tue Jan 15, 2013 9:27 pm

I'm trying to find references to hooks and eyes being used in 15th century. I can find references to hooks and eyes in the medieval tailor's assistant, but I can't find any references to them in the dress and textiles MoL book or the dress accessories one. Can anyone point me to some finds or pictures?

thanks



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Colin Middleton
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Re: hooks and eyes

Postby Colin Middleton » Wed Jan 16, 2013 2:29 pm

If you look at a lot of the pictures, you start seeing them in use.

You might find that the MoL has hundreds of them, but didn't bother putting lots of bent bits of wire in their book.

Best of luck,

Colin


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lucy the tudor
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Re: hooks and eyes

Postby lucy the tudor » Wed Jan 16, 2013 4:25 pm

Janet Arnold shows examples on items from the 1560's, the ones on Eleanor of Toledo's gown apparently showing signs of corrosion ( despite the rest of the garment being in goodish nick) so maybe this is a clue to why not many are seen elsewhere?


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kate/bob
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Re: hooks and eyes

Postby kate/bob » Sun Jan 20, 2013 5:32 pm

I want to a find or a picture to make sure I'm using the right sort as I'm trying to be more authentic with each garment make.

I've spent a good hour or so looking at pictures on line with no luck. Back to the books on the shelves tonight. Fingers crossed I don't go blind!!



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Re: hooks and eyes

Postby frances » Mon Jan 21, 2013 12:39 am

Wasn't there someone who used to demonstrate making hooks and eyes. I bet that they will have done the research.



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lucy the tudor
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Re: hooks and eyes

Postby lucy the tudor » Mon Jan 21, 2013 12:51 am

frances wrote:Wasn't there someone who used to demonstrate making hooks and eyes. I bet that they will have done the research.

It would be nice to think so.
I make hooks and eyes too, based on the Janet Arnold ones, and have seen earlier eyelets in portraiture ( though I can't remember where just now). Lots of people demonstrate making felt, but no one has got written evidence of the detail of much beyond the mixing of fibres with the bow things, and rolling pin methods used in hat making in Stockport in later times.
Yes folks, this is asking you to tell me more...


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guthrie
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Re: hooks and eyes

Postby guthrie » Mon Jan 21, 2013 11:22 am

I tried to find hooks and eyes earlier than 16th century, not seen anything definite yet, not even in what access I have to records of finds. You'd think some would show up from metal detecting or suchlike.



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Re: hooks and eyes

Postby kate/bob » Mon Jan 21, 2013 11:50 am

Considering some of the very fine wire that's survived in other finds it's odd that there don't seem to be any hooks and eyes. I think I might give up that idea and use a different sort of fastening for the moment.



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Re: hooks and eyes

Postby guthrie » Tue Jan 22, 2013 1:46 pm

Exactly - wire, needles, pins have all been found, but not hooks and eyes?



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Re: hooks and eyes

Postby frances » Mon Jan 28, 2013 11:40 pm

I've seen Roman hooks and eyes on a pair of leather shoes in Nottingham Castle a few years back.



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The_Kyle
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Re: hooks and eyes

Postby The_Kyle » Wed Jan 30, 2013 12:35 am

There was a 16th century ship found with lots of them. I'll try and find a link.




Edit:

From a thread over at the armour archive

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Portrait of a court jester, 15th century by Jean Fouquet

Wikipedia link to larger version

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Link to article



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Colin Middleton
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Re: hooks and eyes

Postby Colin Middleton » Wed Jan 30, 2013 2:11 pm

Just to look at this from a different angle. We see lots of 15th C pictures with no obvious means of closing the garments. How do we beleive that these were held shut unless by hook-and-eye?

Once you've got your list, work out which are the most probable, based on fasions before and after (i.e. are we likley to go from button to hidden laces to hooks and eyes, or straight from buttons to hooks and eyes?)

Best wishes

Colin


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kate/bob
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Re: hooks and eyes

Postby kate/bob » Wed Jan 30, 2013 5:54 pm

oooooo.. like the picture. That I'll take as piece of evidence number 1!



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Alice the Huswyf
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Re: hooks and eyes

Postby Alice the Huswyf » Wed Feb 06, 2013 10:03 pm

Am I the only person who recycles fasteners from discarded garments? Especially as I don't live in a town. Perhaps period recycling of reusable items or the recycling of metal scraps is teh reason for general absence .......


Is it 'coz I is middewl clarse, aih?

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lucy the tudor
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Re: hooks and eyes

Postby lucy the tudor » Thu Feb 07, 2013 10:57 am

Did I ever mention how much I love you, Mr The Kyle ?
Alice, you're not the only one, and I still have my Nan's button collection, which she had dutifully cut off any garment which was too tired to keep, and I use them .


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kate/bob
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Re: hooks and eyes

Postby kate/bob » Thu Feb 07, 2013 2:05 pm

I have a whole set of drawers full of stuff that I've saved from various places. My 5 year old seems to think it's magic as I dont' think it's failed us yet when we've needed a random something for a project!



aendr
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Re: hooks and eyes

Postby aendr » Thu Feb 07, 2013 2:47 pm

I find myself amazed at how many people don't keep buttons!
(And they're really good entertainments for small children, once they're past the eating everything stage.)


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