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Posted: Wed Dec 14, 2005 5:30 pm
by Skevmeister
Does anybody have any references or pointers for pattersn and historical references for them, as I am interested in making some of my own, and was wondering if my esteemed and learned colleagues could help me in my search.


Posted: Wed Dec 14, 2005 6:07 pm
by Chickun
This was discussed on the "old" site a while back I think. The conclusions that I remember we came to were that there are no extant examples, only period (15th C) art. The pieces that come to mind are the Memling St. Ursula Tryptich(sp) and there is also a guy wearing them when he is climbing a ladder in the 1470s Froissart "Siege of Brest" available online at the BnF.

Hope this helps.

Posted: Wed Dec 14, 2005 6:09 pm
by Skevmeister
Cheers Chickun have already found the St Ursula images, and will look for the other reference.


Posted: Wed Dec 14, 2005 6:40 pm
by Gandi
there's also some in 'the adoration of St Vincent' polyptych in Portugal. I can't put my hand on a copy of the image at the moment, but if memory serves, it's probably the best of the very few images of these items that exist.

Posted: Thu Dec 15, 2005 10:16 am
by Nigel
If you have a look at Debs's website (np plug honest guv) there is at least one image she has used of somebody with Jack chains, may take some finding.



Posted: Thu Dec 15, 2005 11:45 am
by Nigel
Just checked the site

its on the gallery page top right

its probably already been mnetioned


Posted: Thu Dec 15, 2005 12:00 pm
by John Waller
Nice ills here from Mr Embleton showing some jack-chains.

Posted: Thu Dec 15, 2005 12:11 pm
by Skevmeister
Yeah Nige it has but thanks anyway all help is gratefully received. FYI it is the St Ursula Triptich mentioned higher up on this thread.

John do you have the picture as a bigger version of it if you do do you want to email it to alixx at annwnconsultancy dot co dot uk.

Posted: Thu Dec 15, 2005 1:49 pm
by John Waller
Skevmeister, sorry but I can't get it any larger. Type Padded Jacks into google and do an image search to find it online. It's just a very small jpeg.
Better still buy the excellent book Medieval Military Costume from which the illustration is. ... eader-page

Posted: Thu Dec 15, 2005 3:27 pm
by Sal
Yep, it's definitely a good book. Skev - we've got a copy at home, so keep reminding me and I'll bring it next time we see you.

Posted: Thu Dec 15, 2005 3:34 pm
by Phil the Grips
These ones from Matuls( seem to be a pretty standard design based on the St Ursula image-

Posted: Thu Dec 15, 2005 4:12 pm
by Skevmeister
Sal, thanks I will liek to look at that book, may stick it on my list for next year however as I have need to make some more bookshelf space first :( as I dont have enough and I have some more coming for xmas and my beloved is trying to get hold of one for me.

Cheers Phil, have found them, already, gathered they might be. And they are nice aren't they.

Posted: Fri Dec 16, 2005 4:41 pm
by BraveAnimal
*Trying to learn by asking probably stupid questions*

What are Jack chains? What are they for, who would wear them?

Posted: Fri Dec 16, 2005 4:51 pm
by Gail Horn
Brave Animal - I'm glad you asked; I would like to know as well!

Posted: Fri Dec 16, 2005 4:58 pm
by WorkMonkey
I'm no medievalist but when I looked at that picture of them for the first time they struck me as leg armour, like you'd tie them to your belt, then theres a panel that would cover your thighs, a round bit for you knees then a long bit to cover the shins that have holes that look like they'd hold ties, going round your ankle, or I guess they could go on the arms, but they dont appear to have a 360degree twisting mechanism so I'd go with the legs. Wouldnt stop a stab as they dont cover enough, but a horizontal blow would hit the metal and not cut any further presumably.
I'd love to know what they actually do though.

Posted: Fri Dec 16, 2005 5:10 pm
by John Waller
Jack-chains are an additional defense pointed on to the arms of a padded jack in the form of linked plates. A bit of cheap extra protection to reduce the effect of a blow to the outer arm.

Posted: Fri Dec 16, 2005 5:28 pm
by Skevmeister
but quite effective and lighter if your still building that upper body strength.