Dice games

Historic questions, thoughts and other interesting stuff

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charliea
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Dice games

Postby charliea » Tue Jan 03, 2006 12:16 pm

Hi All,

I've been asked to find out about dice games from all periods and thought I'd ask here.

Can anyone help me with links and stuff for rulkes etc and history of the above.

Many thanks!

Charlie



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Cat
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Postby Cat » Tue Jan 03, 2006 1:45 pm

We were discussing one at the weekend, a medieval version of 21 using dice. I think Bucket may know the rules. Try pm'ing him. It's one of those games where you have to use a straight face and lie like mad about what yu've just rolled, and rolling a 2 and a 1 is top notch, but that's all I know.



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Chickun
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Postby Chickun » Tue Jan 03, 2006 2:39 pm

I think the one you're talking about is called "Mya". Unhelpfully though I can't remember the rules either, despite having them explained to me on more than one occasion....


Aw, it's not easy, is it?

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Kate Tiler
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Postby Kate Tiler » Tue Jan 03, 2006 2:45 pm

Cat - that is liar dice, also know as 'Mire' - you have to conceal what you have shaken, and say 'two threes' or 3 and 6 etc, reading the numbers, but you have to say higher than the person who just threw before you - sometimes you get lucky and it really does come out higher, but mostly you have to cheat and just say something higher. You use a cup, & look inside the cup after shaking, without letting anyone else see.

You can get round it by not shaking & just passing on what they passed to you, and saying the same thing they did, but then you are banking on them telling the truth & the person in front of you not challenging you!

If a person challenges & you have lied, you lose a point. If they challenge & you have said the truth, they lose a point. You have three lives & then are out, so the number playing gets smaller.

The lower mumbers in combination are low, so 3 and 2 or 3 and 4 are low scores & easy to beat, pairs are higher, so two 2s is higher than a 5 and 6, up to two 6's, but 2 and 1 beats everything and is called Mire.

You can also look at what you have just been passed, not shake & pass it on as the same score, but that is devilish!

We played it a lot this summer at Kentwell, it took me all week to get the hang of it & I suddenly caught on one night in the hovel & caught 3 people out in turn before anyone twigged that I'd suddenly got the hang of it!
Power!!!

Kentwell is a Tudor re-enactment and I'm sure Mire is a medieval game, but I don't have the documentation, only that it is OK to play authentically in front of the public - very good for playing after a big lunch before you go & do something energetic!


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Kate Tiler
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Postby Kate Tiler » Tue Jan 03, 2006 2:53 pm

Tudor dice text, 'A Manifest Detection of Diceplay'

This book was written by Gilbert Walker, c. 1550:

http://jducoeur.org/game-hist/diceplay.html

General dice games, which may have some history:

http://hometown.aol.com/dicetalk/d6alph.htm


http://www.katetiler.co.uk

http://www.companyofartisans.co.uk

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Cat
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Postby Cat » Fri Jan 06, 2006 6:50 pm

Kate, yep, that's the bunny!



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Karen Larsdatter
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Postby Karen Larsdatter » Fri Jan 06, 2006 10:37 pm

More links to dice games (including Hazard) at http://moas.atlantia.sca.org/wsnlinks/i ... &catid=328



charliea
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Postby charliea » Mon Jan 09, 2006 12:33 pm

Thanks guys! keep the info comin!



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Borsch Monster
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Postby Borsch Monster » Thu Jan 19, 2006 1:47 pm

Kate Tiler wrote:
Kentwell is a Tudor re-enactment and I'm sure Mire is a medieval game, but I don't have the documentation, only that it is OK to play authentically in front of the public - very good for playing after a big lunch before you go & do something energetic!


I wouldn't bet on it. I suspect Kentwell got it of the White company, who I believe, got it off some vikings some time in the late '80s.

However I doubt you're likely to be bowled out by a MOP for playing it.



Loon

Dice games

Postby Loon » Thu Jan 19, 2006 3:38 pm

A version of this game is still played (outside re-enactment circles) in bars in Austria!



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Postby Medicus Matt » Thu Jan 19, 2006 4:23 pm

Borsch Monster wrote:
Kate Tiler wrote:
Kentwell is a Tudor re-enactment and I'm sure Mire is a medieval game, but I don't have the documentation, only that it is OK to play authentically in front of the public - very good for playing after a big lunch before you go & do something energetic!


I wouldn't bet on it. I suspect Kentwell got it of the White company, who I believe, got it off some vikings some time in the late '80s.

However I doubt you're likely to be bowled out by a MOP for playing it.


I think that this is an interesting example of how a re-enactorism becomes accepted as a fact.

The proper rules for the dice game called Meier, Myer, Mire etc are actually more complex than the game being described. For a start, it should be played with three dice. Three of a kinds (Generals) are highest with 666 being the top score. Below 111 you have the Meires, starting with 216 down to 211, below that you just get mixed combos, 665 down to 133. There is no bluffing involved. I suppose you could bluff, creating a new game of Liar Meier!

The game being described is in the previous posts is plain old Liar dice.
I guess at some stage in the dim and distant, someone's got the two games confused and the name stuck.

I have no idea how old these games are though. Sorry.
It a popular belief that Liar dice was a game know to the Romans and Europeans of the early medieval period but I don't think that there's actually any proof of this. It's just been accepted as a given now.
Last edited by Medicus Matt on Fri Jan 20, 2006 6:55 pm, edited 1 time in total.


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gregory23b
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Postby gregory23b » Fri Jan 20, 2006 4:37 pm

As it so happens, Matt is right, Maya, Mire etc is just that, Liar dice in respects to Mejeeval Two doors reenactment.

The WCo played it that after some new member brought it along, it was 'all the rage'. As far we were aware nothing to do with medeival just something to play at night after the MOPs buggered off.

There is another medieval (allegedely) dice game called in and in, I can't remember the rules but it is a pot game, two or more dice, I think about five.

There is nothing stopping people making their own dice games up though.

Very few games were codified, how many of us learned t play rummy from a book, or black jack?

Same issue with card games, just a rough guess some possibles is all there is.


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Medicus Matt
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Postby Medicus Matt » Fri Jan 20, 2006 5:15 pm

gregory23b wrote:As it so happens, Matt is right, .


You seem surprised.

Hehehe :wink:


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gregory23b
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Postby gregory23b » Fri Jan 20, 2006 6:00 pm

nyer nyer

so much for turn of phrase.

If I knew you better I might have meant it that way ;-)

If Plummy had said I certainly would have, moreover I would have drawn unnecessary attention (again) to his grotesque visage and his overall vileness, which I have to say with a measure of pride should be a national monument and I am honoured to know him (in spite of everything).

Innit Plummy you County Cowboy?


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