Tent choices

Moderator: Moderators

James le Turnour
Posts: 13
Joined: Wed Jun 29, 2011 8:05 pm
Location: High Weald, Mid Sussex, In my outhouse

Tent choices

Postby James le Turnour » Thu Jul 07, 2011 1:59 pm

Hi

I'm looking to demonstrate Bowl turning on a bowl lathe at a limited number of reenactments and will be needing a tent to work from/(under if raining) and sleep in. I notice there are a couple of manufactures out there but a little pointing for my requirements would be gratefull.

I'm hoping it will be big enough to sleep 2, + store a knock down lathe +tools etc. Hoping to it will be of this era, preferably English? and of reasonable price. :D

Any Ideas will be useful

Many thanks in advance! :)

james
Last edited by James le Turnour on Thu Jul 07, 2011 5:36 pm, edited 1 time in total.



Jason
Posts: 81
Joined: Fri Mar 24, 2006 10:38 am
Location: Oxford

Re: Tent choices

Postby Jason » Thu Jul 07, 2011 4:20 pm

Past Tents do a large range of top-quality tents, and can be reached on 01280 850386 if you want to chat through your specific needs.



User avatar
Colin Middleton
Absolute Wizard
Posts: 2037
Joined: Thu Aug 11, 2005 12:31 pm
Location: Sheffield
Contact:

Re: Tent choices

Postby Colin Middleton » Fri Jul 08, 2011 12:54 pm

I would be inclined to go with a simple canvas sheet supported with poles. At night, you can then lower it down and peg out the front edge to make a simple soldier's shelter.

However, it might not be everything that you would want from a tent!

Best wishes


Colin

"May 'Blood, blood, blood' be your motto!"

Image

Langley
Post Centurion
Posts: 763
Joined: Thu Aug 14, 2008 1:36 pm
Location: West Midlands

Re: Tent choices

Postby Langley » Fri Jul 08, 2011 4:18 pm

Some of us made a set of work shelters from 3 widths of canvas stitched together and used with 4 poles, two long and two shorter to create a serviceable work awning. You peg one short edge down at the back, ut holes with eyelets halfway along the long edges and hold that up wiht the short poles then raise the front wiht guyed long poles. Refinements can include triangular sides sewn from the bottom back to the half way point and straight down to ground level to keep Welsh horizontal rain at bay. At night, you drop the front poles and cover your workspace up by pegging the front down. We did however sleep in other more conventional tentage but this is great so you can leave a little workshop all set up. See the examples at http://www.medievalfreeco.org.uk/index.html The fletcher has one with sides and there is one of the simpler ones on the turning page photo album on the home page.



James le Turnour
Posts: 13
Joined: Wed Jun 29, 2011 8:05 pm
Location: High Weald, Mid Sussex, In my outhouse

Re: Tent choices

Postby James le Turnour » Sun Jul 10, 2011 3:17 pm

Hi guys thanks for your helpful replies.

I think we're going to bite the bullet and go for a Bergundian from Past Tents. It seems that for your money you get a lot more coverage per pound for a Bergundian, and this would suit us so we can put the lathe actually inside and have living space too. Also this style tent will be useful for us as our wedding night tent that we plan to pitch in a wood :wink: which is probably why we won't make a shelter ourselves.

The Bergundian at size 18' by 10' would be very practical, but equally we don't want to make a glaring mistake given our inexperience in Living History. Would the Bergundian fit ok as a period tent appropriate for my use as an English bowl turner, or would this be likely to be questioned by fellow re-enactors? I would much prefer the idea of the Past Tents traders tent but for the same money we would only get 11' by 8'.

Also regarding fire retardancy, do many events across the country require this, and is it something I could apply myself (if the tent doesn't come with it)?

Your thoughts appreciated as ever :D

James



nest
Posts: 102
Joined: Fri May 06, 2011 10:12 pm

Re: Tent choices

Postby nest » Sun Jul 10, 2011 4:10 pm

Sorry, off topic reply...

Were you at Bentley Woodfair last year and if so, will you be there this year?

Regards
Nest



James le Turnour
Posts: 13
Joined: Wed Jun 29, 2011 8:05 pm
Location: High Weald, Mid Sussex, In my outhouse

Re: Tent choices

Postby James le Turnour » Sun Jul 10, 2011 5:21 pm

No worries Nest :)

Yes, that was me at Bentley last year and I will be there this year too, I love that show, did I chat with you?

I'll also be at Lammas on Eastbourne seafront 30th and 31stJuly :D

james



nest
Posts: 102
Joined: Fri May 06, 2011 10:12 pm

Re: Tent choices

Postby nest » Sun Jul 10, 2011 5:42 pm

I love it to, I saw your stand but was a bit pressed for time so couldn't stop. Look forward to seeing you in Sept and upgrading our eating bowls!

Good luck with your tent hunting and your wedding.

Nest



User avatar
Colin Middleton
Absolute Wizard
Posts: 2037
Joined: Thu Aug 11, 2005 12:31 pm
Location: Sheffield
Contact:

Re: Tent choices

Postby Colin Middleton » Mon Jul 11, 2011 12:43 pm

You're in the great re-enactor's dilema here. 'Burgundian' tents are a medieval style, but the big question is always about who would own one.

[rant mode]
As modern people, we all want far more space than our medieval ancestors would have had. I suspect that a tent that size would house a knight and his bodyservant, or possibly a score or more common men. This is one of those big re-enactorisms that you see everywhere; palacial tents for scummy soldiers.

You need to make the decision yourself about how authentic you're willing to be and buy accordingly. Certainly in a Bergundian, you'll be no worse than the rest of us.
[/rant mode]

Best wishes


Colin

"May 'Blood, blood, blood' be your motto!"

Image

User avatar
Tod
Absolute Wizard
Posts: 2884
Joined: Wed Aug 17, 2005 11:25 am
Location: A small part of Scotland hidden in middle England
Contact:

Re: Tent choices

Postby Tod » Tue Jul 12, 2011 2:16 pm

Colin is spot on poor men in rich tents. :lol:
A friend of mine does pole lathe turning, he has a simple shelter that he puts up using a canvas sheet and poles, behind it he puts a small soldiers tent for sleeping in. The best of both worlds.



User avatar
Clarenceboy
Posts: 149
Joined: Wed Aug 10, 2005 9:41 am
Contact:

Re: Tent choices

Postby Clarenceboy » Wed Jul 13, 2011 12:04 pm

I put together a bit of a list of suppliers in the past for our group, maybe it will prove useful

http://www.pasttents.com/
http://www.tentorium.pl
http://www.medieval-market.biz/
victor james ltd 01283 510285
http://www.Matuls.pl
http://www.medievalfantasiesco.com/index.html
http://www.tymmyt.com/home.htm
http://www.heritagetents.co.uk/products.html?p=1

They vary in quality, desighn and authentisity and given the money I'd go with a hand sewn linen one but hopefully there is something in there to suit all



Nigel
Post Knight
Posts: 1675
Joined: Thu Aug 11, 2005 7:45 am
Location: Pontefract
Contact:

Re: Tent choices

Postby Nigel » Wed Jul 13, 2011 12:15 pm

oUR GROUP POLE ALTHING TYPE SHOUDL BE AT kELMARSH IF YOU WANT TO LOOK AT HIS SET UP


There’s a country in Europe where they treat their ex soldiers with pride no waits for medical treatment after injuries received during service, no amensia from the government. Cant for the life of me recall where it is but I know exactly where it is not.

Marcus Woodhouse
Absolute Wizard
Posts: 3337
Joined: Sat Feb 18, 2006 8:35 pm

Re: Tent choices

Postby Marcus Woodhouse » Wed Jul 13, 2011 9:58 pm

There is a great little moaning letter from a German (Flemish) Knight serving with Charles the Bold at a seige.
He's sharing a tent with about 20 over men (some of whom have very poor hygine standards-and bear in mind this is a soldeir on campaign mentioning this!), worse then that one of the hostages they hung emptied his bowls over the roof of the tent and now the branch he is hanging from has bent on the dead mans feet keep brushing against the tent and keep him awake at night. And this is a Knight, not a common man writing this.
I'd actually like to see more people camping plastic, in a way it would our events more, not less authentic.


OSTENDE MIHI PECUNIAM!

randallmoffett
Posts: 68
Joined: Thu Jun 02, 2011 2:30 am
Location: Currently Northern Utah, Formerly Southampton and York

Re: Tent choices

Postby randallmoffett » Thu Jul 14, 2011 3:44 am

Not sure how sleeping in a modern tent is period or improves anything really for reenactment. If you are a commoner sleep outside or maybe make a shelter outside. I can make a fairly well done shelter in most places in 15-30 minutes. I used to sleep outside all the time though if the weather was right. If you are afraid of rain get a strip of canvas and cover yourself. Even in relatively cold weather in the right clothing and some preparation you will be safe and relatively warm.

Impromptu shelters and people sleeping outside would really make a period encampment.

Reenactment.... not for the weak. :wink:

To be fair I am not a fan of plastic camps, especially if they are too close to the period encampments.... if you want to camp modern, camp modern. Though to be fair I've gone hiking hundreds of miles from anything often with no tent so I might be a bit on the extreme side of this debate.

Randall



Langley
Post Centurion
Posts: 763
Joined: Thu Aug 14, 2008 1:36 pm
Location: West Midlands

Re: Tent choices

Postby Langley » Thu Jul 14, 2011 12:12 pm

Worked with one group at Warwick when was in Gloucesters and they mostly rolled up in cloaks and blankets and slept under the hedges. It looked fantastic. Gloucester's used to have a group tent where many of the younger unattached chaps bunked down together but as tinme has passed those descriptions don't fit too well anymore (sorry guys).

We have been looking at illustrations which appear to show low square shelters built from hurdles and covered with either canvas or grass/ferns which we are considering trying out as window dressing (but we would actually be sleeping in the weatherproof burgundian which during the day is dressed as his lordship's (but he has wandered off hunting just now so you can't see him). We also have a sub-group researching and putting together a Roma camp. We found evidence of Roma smiths travelling and working alongside a gun crew but keeping that little bit apart wiht separate cooling and sleeping as Roma would today. (Been fascinating researching all this - did you spot our Roma with the amazing turban like head-dress and red hair at Tewks?)
Have also had someone use a bender like temporary set up which looked great but took for ever to assemble after a long and tiring journey on a Firday evening when you get to the event.

I think the point about more plastic camping is interesting - the point being there are too many high status tents around for the numbers of common soldiery wandering about. (Makes it too much like work - too many managers and not enough.. but I digress). As I get older and less fit it would be nice to be able to hide a camper or more comfortable accomodation somewhere and point to the bit of hedge with an old blanket in it as where I "slept" last night.

If you are not careful I will start the moaning about not acknowledging the high status people wandering about hte event too.



User avatar
Colin Middleton
Absolute Wizard
Posts: 2037
Joined: Thu Aug 11, 2005 12:31 pm
Location: Sheffield
Contact:

Re: Tent choices

Postby Colin Middleton » Thu Jul 14, 2011 12:27 pm

randallmoffett wrote:Not sure how sleeping in a modern tent is period or improves anything really for reenactment.


Basically, we have too many tents around for the people who are supposed to sleep in them. The more of us that sleep in the plastic camp, the better that ratio gets. I do agree with your assertion that the plastic camp needs to be out of site of the authentic camp.


Colin

"May 'Blood, blood, blood' be your motto!"

Image

randallmoffett
Posts: 68
Joined: Thu Jun 02, 2011 2:30 am
Location: Currently Northern Utah, Formerly Southampton and York

Re: Tent choices

Postby randallmoffett » Thu Jul 14, 2011 2:55 pm

Langley,

Now that is what I am talking about! Sounds like Gloucester's was doing it right.

Colin,

To be honest I'd rather them mass in a large and simple tent than plastic camp if they do not want to sleep outside. In many ways because we usually have smaller numbers the tents make the encampment look more like the cool pictures in medieval manuscripts.

As well it sort of breaks up the camaraderie of the group having a large number elsewhere half the time.

So if anyone wants to try a shelter.
Look at the last 6 or so for a few good examples of temporary shelters.

http://adventure.howstuffworks.com/surv ... elter2.htm
http://www.wilderness-survival.net/shelters-2.php
http://www.one-stop-survival-guide.com/ ... elter.html
http://www.inquiry.net/outdoor/shelter/wild_shelter.htm

I have made a fair number of these shelters so if anyone wants to try I can help. I have been thinking it might be something that can be made more or less portable and brought much like a tent would be. So far I have been rained on and it was fine and even in snow they seem to hold up well.

RPM



Marcus Woodhouse
Absolute Wizard
Posts: 3337
Joined: Sat Feb 18, 2006 8:35 pm

Re: Tent choices

Postby Marcus Woodhouse » Thu Jul 14, 2011 8:41 pm

Randell you are clearly a god amonst re-enactors who wants to do nothing but live like they lived 500 years ago. No doubt you refuse to take cans of beer and brew it on site and have pulled out teeth "cos they all had bad teeth back in them days". I also imagine you travel to events by horse and cart.
I suspect that you don't have a partner or children to worry about either.
When I am on my own I share a tent, when I'm with my family, who are reluctant re-enactors I don't. I actually prefer to go into a plastic camp as they are often the quieter option.
Given that a man of my status would be bedding down at the nearest abbey/manor/castle/town and that there is little evidence that English armies in the WOTR were anything like those on the mainland of Europe I.m not sure what a "authentic camp" would have looked like so go and beat someone else with your authetcity stick, I did enough of the stupid B***cks you are talking about as a real soldier in real wars so I'm buggered if I'm going to do it for fun 20 years on.


OSTENDE MIHI PECUNIAM!

randallmoffett
Posts: 68
Joined: Thu Jun 02, 2011 2:30 am
Location: Currently Northern Utah, Formerly Southampton and York

Re: Tent choices

Postby randallmoffett » Thu Jul 14, 2011 11:20 pm

Marcus,

Whoa! Did not realize it was against forum rules to have an opinion here. :?

I simply asked a simple question which Colin answered very well and replied with an opinion.

When you make such a statement 'I'd actually like to see more people camping plastic, in a way it would our events more, not less authentic.'

Authentic to me seems to exclude plastic modern tents for a medieval encampment. So I simply replied with possible choices to help the post along with some possible authentic solutions. I even admitted I might be a bit extreme and made light of if.


Do have a family and still growing, thanks for asking.

No stick beating carried out in need of being carried out. Do not claim to be a god, do not want the responsibility.

Randall



acecat999
Post Centurion
Posts: 633
Joined: Thu Jun 30, 2011 12:14 am

Re: Tent choices

Postby acecat999 » Thu Jul 14, 2011 11:55 pm

like marcus - it depends who we have in tow.

i've kipped in a greatcoat/cloak or in the back of the car on me own but for some reason the missus expects me to bring the tents and beds and sh**.

this forum is quite happy for you to bring an opinion randall, just if it doesn't match at least 50% of the forum users opinion then expect to be shot down, after all opinions are a bit like arseholes. everyone's got one and everyone thinks everyone else's stinks


everyday i can be an insignificant but unavoidable nuisance is a day well spent.

randallmoffett
Posts: 68
Joined: Thu Jun 02, 2011 2:30 am
Location: Currently Northern Utah, Formerly Southampton and York

Re: Tent choices

Postby randallmoffett » Fri Jul 15, 2011 4:08 am

In response to evidence for tent usage in England we know at least the uppers did indeed have tents. There was a specific post called sergeant of the king's tents and pavilions whose entire job was to keep them in order and logistically get them set up for the king in war or otherwise. Henry VI's was John Burgh, esq. Patent Rolls of Henry VI, vol 4, pg. 98 and 220. It seems more common to elect these men right before a campaign such as Edward III does in 1358 with Adam Shirburn for his upcoming war with France. Patent Rolls of Edward III, vol. 11, pg. 14-15. This account actually indicates a rather large force was needed for their repair, transport and set up. Wood was also gathered for these tents before hand as in Edward III does in April 1352 (Patent rolls, pg. 251. The wood used is ‘ash and other kind’. There is evidence that every king from Henry III to Edward IV had this position filled.

It seems the English used pavilions just like everyone else. Here is Froissarts account of post Poitiers for an example.
‘Then the prince's banner was set up a-high on a bush, and trumpets and clarions began to sown. Then the prince did off his bassenet, and the knights for his body and they of his chamber were ready about him, and a red pavilion pight up, and then drink was brought forth to the prince and for such lords as were about him, the which still increased as they came from the chase: there they tarried and their prisoners with them.’

First thing they do is head back to their warm and inviting pavilions to relax.

There is also evidence the City of London owned pavilions as well and used them for all sorts of uses. 6 Edward II. A.D. 1312. Letter-Book D. fol. clxviii.

In de Joinvilles chronicle he even mentions a tent set up as a chapel. (pg. 58) In the same account some men even had tents and pavilions for their horses. ‘Now it happened that Lord Walter of Autreche had himself armed at all points within his pavilion; and when he was mounted on his horse, with his shield about his neck and his helmet on his head, he bade lift up the tent-flaps, and pricked out against the Turks; and as he started off alone from his pavilion his servants all set up a cry of "Châtillon!’ (pg. 81) He also claims later that footmen struck their own tents (pg. 117). He indicates a large number of camp tents for the army in general later on page 390. The Islamic armies seem to have tents and pavilions for even more, one set over a open area of water intended for bathing and relaxation. For the most part it seems the knightly class and their betters but there are some cases where it seems to indicate that perhaps non-nobles used them.

I will check out a few other resources as I have time. We are getting to finals so it might be some time.

Acecat,

this forum is quite happy for you to bring an opinion randall, just if it doesn't match at least 50% of the forum users opinion then expect to be shot down


Sounds like this will be lots of fun then.

I always thought they all stunk. :P

Randall



Langley
Post Centurion
Posts: 763
Joined: Thu Aug 14, 2008 1:36 pm
Location: West Midlands

Re: Tent choices

Postby Langley » Fri Jul 15, 2011 8:57 am

Thanks for all those historic references Randall. Had a look at some of the survival shelter stuff. They are mostly the sort of thing anyone who was in Scouts should be familiar with and I suspect of great antiquity when you replace plastic with fern etc. before anyone says they are too difficult to put up before a weekend event - any scout I ever trained could do one in a very short time indeed on the Friday evening of a weekend backwoods camp. (Taught them to cook with no utensils as well but that is another story for the Food aqnd Drink section!). I think the real problem is availability of materials for any number of people trying to do it at events - we usually have access to a field and possibly the margins but not enough woods to source decent cover for everyone. Perhaps I shoud do a shelter building workshop at Boot Camp though now that I have opened my big mouth... Jon who does the Black Powder talks is a current scouter as is Lyn his wife so maybe as I also help with the Black Powder stuff he and I could run this second thing as well. (Pause to see how long before Laurie spots this....)



User avatar
Colin Middleton
Absolute Wizard
Posts: 2037
Joined: Thu Aug 11, 2005 12:31 pm
Location: Sheffield
Contact:

Re: Tent choices

Postby Colin Middleton » Fri Jul 15, 2011 12:59 pm

I'd be up for that!


Colin

"May 'Blood, blood, blood' be your motto!"

Image

User avatar
Clarenceboy
Posts: 149
Joined: Wed Aug 10, 2005 9:41 am
Contact:

Re: Tent choices

Postby Clarenceboy » Fri Jul 15, 2011 1:20 pm

We did a walk this February gone using some rough shelters and popped some pics on here if you were interested viewtopic.php?f=16&t=24524



Langley
Post Centurion
Posts: 763
Joined: Thu Aug 14, 2008 1:36 pm
Location: West Midlands

Re: Tent choices

Postby Langley » Fri Jul 15, 2011 3:28 pm

Yaeh - saw those Jack. Well done you guys. I'm a bit past too much helathy exercise these days but of course used to do lots in Scouting days (as a scout and a scout leader not to mention as a scout leader trainer). We have a member who plays a pilgrim. He was a postman and regularly walked 15 miles a day. He took 3 weeks and did as much of the Camino as he could fit in so he could talk with real authority on the subject. Unfortunately the experience did his health not a lot of good and showed up heart problems he did not know he had before and for which he than had to be treated. Anyway - sounds like I need to talk to Jon and Laurie about doing something at Boot Camp...



Marcus Woodhouse
Absolute Wizard
Posts: 3337
Joined: Sat Feb 18, 2006 8:35 pm

Re: Tent choices

Postby Marcus Woodhouse » Mon Jul 18, 2011 1:10 pm

I wasn't going to bother replying but...
At every event I attend to the plastic site is seperate to the "authentic" one.
At every event I attend there is seldom enough, or any loose wood around to make a fire with let along a shelter. (I doubt that Wrest park, Lydiard Park, Berkeley castle, et al, would be too happy if a hoard of men in silly clothes started chopping down their topriary).

I also question...
Just how relevent the references to Kings of England are to establishing an "authentic camp"-they are always going to have the most written about them and you would expect them to be living in little palaces on wheels anyhow as they are, well, Kings.
How relevent boy scout survival skills are-most medieval people lived in houses and tended to stick by them and when they did move around they stayed in other houses (which was possible when it was a Christian virtue to house travellers in hospices, monasteries, great halls etc). The only people I can see having the skills you mention would be out laws, shepherds and charcoal burners, none of whom are likely to be mustered for war.
How relevent images of conteintal seiges and campaigns are to England.

Authentic living history camps are, in my experience anything but that as they are filled with people who shouldn't be there (women, children, traders, tradesmen) and very low on the things that should be there (animals and troops). They look pretty and are expected by the people who stage events as they add colour and olde worldeness, I never look at them as being "what a real medeival camp would look like"

If sleeping in a white bell tent defines what a re-enactor is then I guess that I am not one of them. However as I keep being invited along to dress up in funny clothes and take part in shows I will not let that bother me too much.


OSTENDE MIHI PECUNIAM!

Marcus Woodhouse
Absolute Wizard
Posts: 3337
Joined: Sat Feb 18, 2006 8:35 pm

Re: Tent choices

Postby Marcus Woodhouse » Mon Jul 18, 2011 1:15 pm

What Jack did though is different and as he knows I am planning on doing a similar walk during the pilgrims season next year, but that will be for my own selfish benefit, will not invlove me needing to please an event organisor, group leader or for re-encatment at all. I just want at some point to sod off on my own, or close to my own with suitable "kit" and gear and see what works and what does not. What he did is, to me, living history, not what goes on at renfayre events.


OSTENDE MIHI PECUNIAM!

User avatar
robin wood
Posts: 113
Joined: Mon Sep 17, 2007 5:07 pm
Location: edale, peak district
Contact:

Re: Tent choices

Postby robin wood » Tue Jul 19, 2011 8:56 am

James le Turnour wrote:Also regarding fire retardancy, do many events across the country require this, and is it something I could apply myself (if the tent doesn't come with it)?

Your thoughts appreciated as ever :D

James


Hi James,

Fire retardency is becoming more important, mandatory at Glastonbury and most other festivals this year and I expect it to spread to re enactment world too though I have not done re enactment events for a few years. You can buy fabric treatment which gives you the certificate but it is expensive.

Re tent for pole lathe, I personally never bothered with a shelter for the lathe only for the stock. Unless your shelter is big enough for public to stand in too, if it is wassing it down they will not stand in the rain to watch. I work in drizzle and stop when everyone runs for cover.



randallmoffett
Posts: 68
Joined: Thu Jun 02, 2011 2:30 am
Location: Currently Northern Utah, Formerly Southampton and York

Re: Tent choices

Postby randallmoffett » Tue Jul 19, 2011 7:52 pm

James,

Is there a way to fire proof a tent from standard canvas?

Marcus,

I agree with much of what you are saying. Men would certainly have stayed as much as possible in a monastery or other existing location before living in a tent. We have evidence of this both at home and abroad in peace and war. This is more often the case in peaceful lands where the population is friendly and the force in question is not large.

There are some key issues though. Many hundreds or thousands of soldiers could not be housed in such a way. Considering most monasteries held only a score or less men and were relatively small this was a further consideration. Most monasteries would likely be filled by simply the lead of the army and his household. The remainder of knights and nobles would pitch tents and the masses do what they could. If the stay were of some duration they would set more permanent shelters up.

As well in friendly villages did not want large numbers of troops in their homes or barns as can be seen in several statutes by Edward III, Henry V and Henry VI. A good example from Southampton was when the King (HV) ordered the mayor of the town to ensure the soldiers were camped away from the locals and appropriately taken care of for several months before their departure for France in 1420. A smaller force sent to defend Southampton later in the century were quartered in large civic buildings for the most part and the remainder in homes of the well off and monastic locations, though the force was not more than 100-150 men.

In unfriendly lands this was not often the case and as many accounts of the period show the knightly class and up lived in tents, the rest where they could. There is evidence where men simply removed the local inhabitants from their homes and used them but Edward III and Henry V had ordinances against this and men were prosecuted for this to an extent, though I could not say how often it was or was not done.

So the idea of 'billeting' while appropriate for the period in general is not always appropriate.

Now saying only outlaws had these skills to make such shelters is just incorrect for anyone except perhaps the knightly class and up. The average serf, commoner, etc. would be able to make shelters easily as it ties into half a dozen chores they grew up learning. Wharram Percy and other village excavations showed many such likely structures. That said these were likely made for storage and animal shelters but the skills are very present. I agree though that outlaws and shepherds and such would be likely to have useful skills as well but there is a great deal of evidence to support the pardon of outlaws for military service.

Now I know of no examples in medieval English art but there are at least a dozen examples of these shelters in period art for the 14th to 16th century in a military context so they were clearly used.

Now as to women and children... generally I think you are right. That said Froissart, Le Baker, Monsrelet, Waurin and many other chroniclers indicate it was a relatively common or acceptable practice, at least among the nobility. I agree that animals, carts, wagons and a plethora of other items would be more likely, and some animals likely cleaner and quieter than some children

There is actually a great deal of evidence for knightly use of tents/pavilions in text as well as art. Here are a few medieval English examples.

St. Georges Chapel, Windsor Castle, 1477-1483
Thompson Yates MS 33 f.167, late 15th
Egerton 3028, fs. 79, 84v. 89v. 96, 2nd quarter of 14th (some great early plate armour in this MS BTW)
Harley 3954 fs. 50 and 56, 2nd quarter 15th, East Anglian.
Queen Mary Psalter, Royal B VII MS, f. 28v.
Lydgates, Troy Book Royal 18 MS, f. 55, London 1450s.

To me the issue of if they are doing it wrong by using a period style tent encampment, by the information I have seen from the period I'd not say so and see little evidence to the contrary. Of course our medieval counterparts would want a nice warm manor or monastic complex as a first choice, seeing many of them how they are now they often must have been comfortable but the evidence in support of tents and other shelters is there. Yet once again there is literally hundreds of detailed sources of evidence supporting many of these occurrences of encampments. Of course with varying degrees of fluxuation.

After seeing how some people dress today I do not think anyone has a right to call medieval clothing funny.... with go go boots, MC Hammer pants and the likes the last fifty years of fashion are likely going to be a low point in history. :D

Randall



guthrie
Absolute Wizard
Posts: 2349
Joined: Sun Aug 14, 2005 8:54 pm
Location: Polmont-Edinburgh

Re: Tent choices

Postby guthrie » Wed Jul 20, 2011 12:35 am

In my opinion you'd be better just making up a shelter for yourself and the lathe, say about 10ft frontage and 6 foot high, ^ shaped at the front down to a point at the back.
Then sleep in the plastic camp. The idea of a wood turner having an authenti-tent is just silly. But a shelter to work under would be much cheaper, easier to transport and require only one or two poles, and let you sprawl out in the plastic camp.




Return to “1100-1500”

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 5 guests